[EXTERNAL] [C400] Catalina 400 - wing keel draft
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Frank Falcone
Hi Aaron:
My boat, SILVER EAGLE, is a 2002 Mark II. It has an advertised draft of 5’9”. I think that’s correct because I have my depth sounder set for that depth. After running aground a few times, I think that it’s accurate. My friend has a 2005 Mark II. His advertised draft is 5’6”. As I understand, these are the 2 versions. I never heard of the 5’0” draft for a C400.
Regards, Frank, #247
From: C400@Catalina400-445.groups.io <C400@Catalina400-445.groups.io>
On Behalf Of Aaron Stein via groups.io
Hi, I have been looking at 400s and I cannot figure out what the actual draft is for the wing keel. Sailboatdata says 5’9”, but some postings have 5’0” and someone said there were two version of the wing. Can anyone tell me what the actual draft is and if there is any way to tell which “version” a boat might have (if it’s in the water – and not grounded J )?
Thanks!
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Tom Sokoloski
Aaron, Not sure my last post went thru, so I'll post again. My 2006 #307 wing keel draws 5', plus or minus 1". Tom Soko Juniper #307 Noank, CT
On Wed, Jul 29, 2020, 9:14 AM Frank Falcone <frank.falcone@...> wrote:
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Tom Soko Juniper #307 Noank, CT
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Gerald Canning <gwcanning@...>
I have hull #334 with a wing keel. My draft is 5’. However I think the earlier hulls may have a draft of 5’3”.
toggle quoted messageShow quoted text
Gerald Canning
On Jul 29, 2020, at 9:14 AM, Frank Falcone <frank.falcone@...> wrote:
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Aaron Stein <asltl.sailing@...>
Yes Tom, got it. Thanks! Aaron Sent from my Samsung Galaxy smartphone.
-------- Original message -------- From: Tom Sokoloski <tomsoko@...> Date: 7/29/20 9:23 AM (GMT-05:00) To: C400@catalina400-445.groups.io Subject: Re: [EXTERNAL] [C400] Catalina 400 - wing keel draft Aaron, Not sure my last post went thru, so I'll post again. My 2006 #307 wing keel draws 5', plus or minus 1". Tom Soko Juniper #307 Noank, CT On Wed, Jul 29, 2020, 9:14 AM Frank Falcone <frank.falcone@...> wrote:
-- Tom Soko Juniper #307 Noank, CT
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Frank Falcone
WOW! We’re all over the place with C400 drafts; 5’0”, 5’3”, 5’6” and 5’9”!
From: C400@Catalina400-445.groups.io <C400@Catalina400-445.groups.io>
On Behalf Of Gerald Canning via groups.io
I have hull #334 with a wing keel. My draft is 5’. However I think the earlier hulls may have a draft of 5’3”. Gerald Canning
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Hull 174 has a draft of 5’6”
Matt Perry Exuberant
From: C400@Catalina400-445.groups.io <C400@Catalina400-445.groups.io> On Behalf Of Frank Falcone
Sent: Wednesday, July 29, 2020 10:12 AM To: C400@Catalina400-445.groups.io Subject: Re: [EXTERNAL] [C400] Catalina 400 - wing keel draft
WOW! We’re all over the place with C400 drafts; 5’0”, 5’3”, 5’6” and 5’9”!
From: C400@Catalina400-445.groups.io <C400@Catalina400-445.groups.io> On Behalf Of Gerald Canning via groups.io
I have hull #334 with a wing keel. My draft is 5’. However I think the earlier hulls may have a draft of 5’3”. Gerald Canning
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K Pitser <Kpitser@...>
I received the following response from Catalina yachts since I, too, am interested in getting the history behind the changes..... Yes, of course, I realize that, but first wanted to know which you # personally had in deference to your waiting for wind and tide to move. The earlier 400’s wing keel (as you have) was a very substantial performer, (maybe too racy) esp for what many or some might of called “the shallow or lesser draft” as it performed very close, probably too close to the fin keel which was designed for West Coast US, Canada, lake Superior & Michigan, Australia, much of Europe and the Med. However since it was drawing right about 5’- 6”-7” , as it left here on trailer, with no options or gear on board, they all gained a few inches in use. With many requests for a shallower wing keel, (Southeast US, East Coast, the Gulf, the Islands, etc, starting between hulls 305 thru 309 the 400’s wing draft was reduced 6 ½” to near 7” by taking 3 or 4 inches out of the molded keel stub of the hull and taking the rest off the lead wing keel, but the weight of it was compensated so it would still have the same righting moment. The fin keel did not change or need to due to its deep water destinations. The rudder went from a 60” blade to a 50” blade. There was also a special mod done to hull # 223 to make very close to 5 ft dry.
On Jul 29, 2020, at 10:11, Frank Falcone <frank.falcone@...> wrote:
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K Pitser <Kpitser@...>
And for context, I am hull #0206. Year 2000, Largo Florida manufactured.
On Jul 29, 2020, at 13:09, K Pitser via groups.io <Kpitser@...> wrote:
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Jim Ebmeyer
I did a measurement a few years ago, while the boat was on the cradle. I put a 2x4 under the keel sticking out at a right angle. I measured vertically up to the scum line, and got 5’ 10”. I think the draft varies a few inches based on the amount of “stuff “ one the boat. In our case, we have an inflatable dingy on davits on the stern, and a 9.9hp Mercury outboard on the aft railing, full water tanks, etc. I also typically carry a couple of 5gal. diesel containers on the port rail, and 5gal. of gasoline for the outboard. The water tanks are usually full. All of this extra weight adds to the draft.
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BTW - we are putting our boat on the market, after 20 years. We are old enough now, to try to do other things on the agenda while we have time. If you know anyone who is interested in the 400, they can contact me at: jebmeyer@... Jim Ebmeyer Tranquility II, C400 hull #14 Penfield, NY 585-381-3395
On Jul 29, 2020, at 9:21 AM, Tom Sokoloski <tomsoko@...> wrote:
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Aaron Stein <asltl.sailing@...>
This is excellent info – thanks!
From: C400@Catalina400-445.groups.io [mailto:C400@Catalina400-445.groups.io] On Behalf Of K Pitser
Sent: Wednesday, July 29, 2020 1:09 PM To: C400@catalina400-445.groups.io Subject: Re: [EXTERNAL] [C400] Catalina 400 - wing keel draft
I received the following response from Catalina yachts since I, too, am interested in getting the history behind the changes.....
Yes, of course, I realize that, but first wanted to know which you # personally had in deference to your waiting for wind and tide to move. The earlier 400’s wing keel (as you have) was a very substantial performer, (maybe too racy) esp for what many or some might of called “the shallow or lesser draft” as it performed very close, probably too close to the fin keel which was designed for West Coast US, Canada, lake Superior & Michigan, Australia, much of Europe and the Med. However since it was drawing right about 5’- 6”-7” , as it left here on trailer, with no options or gear on board, they all gained a few inches in use. With many requests for a shallower wing keel, (Southeast US, East Coast, the Gulf, the Islands, etc, starting between hulls 305 thru 309 the 400’s wing draft was reduced 6 ½” to near 7” by taking 3 or 4 inches out of the molded keel stub of the hull and taking the rest off the lead wing keel, but the weight of it was compensated so it would still have the same righting moment. The fin keel did not change or need to due to its deep water destinations. The rudder went from a 60” blade to a 50” blade. There was also a special mod done to hull # 223 to make very close to 5 ft dry.
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Roger Calvert
toggle quoted messageShow quoted text
From: Aaron Stein
Sent: Wednesday, July 29, 2020 3:09 PM To: C400@Catalina400-445.groups.io Subject: Re: [EXTERNAL] [C400] Catalina 400 - wing keel draft
This is excellent info – thanks!
From: C400@Catalina400-445.groups.io [mailto:C400@Catalina400-445.groups.io] On Behalf Of K Pitser
I received the following response from Catalina yachts since I, too, am interested in getting the history behind the changes.....
Yes, of course, I realize that, but first wanted to know which you # personally had in deference to your waiting for wind and tide to move. The earlier 400’s wing keel (as you have) was a very substantial performer, (maybe too racy) esp for what many or some might of called “the shallow or lesser draft” as it performed very close, probably too close to the fin keel which was designed for West Coast US, Canada, lake Superior & Michigan, Australia, much of Europe and the Med. However since it was drawing right about 5’- 6”-7” , as it left here on trailer, with no options or gear on board, they all gained a few inches in use. With many requests for a shallower wing keel, (Southeast US, East Coast, the Gulf, the Islands, etc, starting between hulls 305 thru 309 the 400’s wing draft was reduced 6 ½” to near 7” by taking 3 or 4 inches out of the molded keel stub of the hull and taking the rest off the lead wing keel, but the weight of it was compensated so it would still have the same righting moment. The fin keel did not change or need to due to its deep water destinations. The rudder went from a 60” blade to a 50” blade. There was also a special mod done to hull # 223 to make very close to 5 ft dry.
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David Cherry <cherryd500@...>
Between hull # 287 and 312 the keel was shortened from 5ft 9 in to 5ft 3 in.
On Jul 29, 2020, at 9:39 AM, Gerald Canning <gwcanning@...> wrote:
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David Cherry <cherryd500@...>
Sorry forgot to say winged keel on hull 287!and 312. I noticed the change when I saw both hulls out of the water sitting next to each other
On Jul 30, 2020, at 6:50 AM, David Cherry via groups.io <cherryd500@...> wrote:
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Frank Falcone
WOW, I thought it was a reduction from 5’9” to 5’6”!
From: C400@Catalina400-445.groups.io <C400@Catalina400-445.groups.io>
On Behalf Of David Cherry via groups.io
Between hull # 287 and 312 the keel was shortened from 5ft 9 in to 5ft 3 in.
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Frank Falcone
WOW! We’re all over the place; 5’9”, 5’6”, 5’4”, 5’3” 5’0”!
From: C400@Catalina400-445.groups.io <C400@Catalina400-445.groups.io>
On Behalf Of Roger Calvert via groups.io
Hull #276 Surveyed at 64”
Surprise
Sent from Mail for Windows 10
From: Aaron Stein
This is excellent info – thanks!
From:
C400@Catalina400-445.groups.io [mailto:C400@Catalina400-445.groups.io]
On Behalf Of K Pitser
I received the following response from Catalina yachts since I, too, am interested in getting the history behind the changes.....
Yes, of course, I realize that, but first wanted to know which you # personally had in deference to your waiting for wind and tide to move. The earlier 400’s wing keel (as you have) was a very substantial performer, (maybe too racy) esp for what many or some might of called “the shallow or lesser draft” as it performed very close, probably too close to the fin keel which was designed for West Coast US, Canada, lake Superior & Michigan, Australia, much of Europe and the Med. However since it was drawing right about 5’- 6”-7” , as it left here on trailer, with no options or gear on board, they all gained a few inches in use. With many requests for a shallower wing keel, (Southeast US, East Coast, the Gulf, the Islands, etc, starting between hulls 305 thru 309 the 400’s wing draft was reduced 6 ½” to near 7” by taking 3 or 4 inches out of the molded keel stub of the hull and taking the rest off the lead wing keel, but the weight of it was compensated so it would still have the same righting moment. The fin keel did not change or need to due to its deep water destinations. The rudder went from a 60” blade to a 50” blade. There was also a special mod done to hull # 223 to make very close to 5 ft dry.
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